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Sepefeets Silverfish update (OG, Kara, MSG)
Elekid
#730 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 2:28:02 PM(UTC)
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Why does it choose to:

834. attackWithMinion: Leper Gnome target: Ooze choice: 0 place0
943. attackWithHero: Malfurion Stormrage target: Knight of the Wild choice: 0 place0

And not the other way around? Now it takes 6 facedamage from the Knight of the Wild, instead of 1 from the Ooze.
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sepefeets on 7/28/2016(UTC)
BlackOak
#723 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 3:18:25 PM(UTC)
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sepefeets;40001 wrote:
It's intentional to keep people aware that they have no base settings.


I haven't changed anything about how combos work so if that rule caused it to coin axe on turn 1 before then it probably still does. You can take a turn 1 board with coin, throw it in test.txt, and modify it to include a fiery war axe in hand cards to check.

Thanks for the info, with Dre's help axe now on turn 2 without using coin just what I wanted :)
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sepefeets on 7/28/2016(UTC), Dre on 7/29/2016(UTC)
sepefeets
#731 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 4:27:42 PM(UTC)

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Elekid;40004 wrote:
Why does it choose to:

834. attackWithMinion: Leper Gnome target: Ooze choice: 0 place0
943. attackWithHero: Malfurion Stormrage target: Knight of the Wild choice: 0 place0

And not the other way around? Now it takes 6 facedamage from the Knight of the Wild, instead of 1 from the Ooze.

Data sync. Look at the action list after the first board of the turn to see what SF really wanted to do.
Quote:
set best action-----------------------------------
-a-
useability
-a-
attack with hero, enemy: ooze id 152
-a-
attacker: bomblobber id 116, enemy: druid id 64
-a-
play knightofthewild id 137, pos 2
-a-
attacker: lepergnome id 112, enemy: knightofthewild id 84

Druid hero power is totally screwed because of data sync. HR usually tells SF that your hero doesn't have any attack right after shapeshift is used, then on the next update it does.
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Elekid on 8/1/2016(UTC)
Badi
#732 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 4:37:08 PM(UTC)

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Guys about data sync there is a problem with HR itself. I tested it even i build-in fast A.I. and sometimes there are data sync bugs too (testes on i7).
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sepefeets on 7/28/2016(UTC)
carins
#734 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 5:16:12 PM(UTC)

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So I should be using a standard capable hunter or shaman deck to hit 5? I was using a Wild Secret Paladin deck because I remember reading on here that it's computationally less intensive than other decks which means the bot will rope less which is obviously crucial. But if there's 4x as many wild decks as standard, I can see why it's not getting above rank 10. The issue there is that a new set is being introduced tonight and I don't have all the cards for hunter, only shaman lol. Thanks for the help
sepefeets
#735 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 6:51:09 PM(UTC)

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carins;40009 wrote:
So I should be using a standard capable hunter or shaman deck to hit 5? I was using a Wild Secret Paladin deck because I remember reading on here that it's computationally less intensive than other decks which means the bot will rope less which is obviously crucial. But if there's 4x as many wild decks as standard, I can see why it's not getting above rank 10. The issue there is that a new set is being introduced tonight and I don't have all the cards for hunter, only shaman lol. Thanks for the help

See the rank 5 thread and discuss there please.
parakeet
#733 Posted : Thursday, July 28, 2016 8:48:13 PM(UTC)

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Badi;40008 wrote:
Guys about data sync there is a problem with HR itself. I tested it even i build-in fast A.I. and sometimes there are data sync bugs too (testes on i7).

If you modify the AI to use speed it may still encounter datasync when HR sends bad data. But yes, datasync is a problem with HR collecting data about the board too early.
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sepefeets on 7/29/2016(UTC)
carins
#736 Posted : Friday, July 29, 2016 4:15:40 PM(UTC)

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http://pastebin.com/At4fDgR6

Not sure this is an issue, but worth posting.

The bot chose to deal exact lethal by RBW the Squire, dropping a second Drake, LB face, and attacking with Drake.

I don't know if it matters or is coded in a suboptimal way, but I thought it odd it didn't want to drop Al'Akir, RBW it, and go face. It was like the bot was trying to be as optimal as possible in case it somehow dealt lethal but didn't actually win the game, and then had to continue playing so it didn't want to do any excess damage lol. That, or it wanted to attempt to BM. Does it even matter?
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sepefeets on 7/29/2016(UTC)
sepefeets
#737 Posted : Friday, July 29, 2016 4:26:07 PM(UTC)

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carins;40033 wrote:
http://pastebin.com/At4fDgR6

Not sure this is an issue, but worth posting.

The bot chose to deal exact lethal by RBW the Squire, dropping a second Drake, LB face, and attacking with Drake.

I don't know if it matters or is coded in a suboptimal way, but I thought it odd it didn't want to drop Al'Akir, RBW it, and go face. It was like the bot was trying to be as optimal as possible in case it somehow dealt lethal but didn't actually win the game, and then had to continue playing so it didn't want to do any excess damage lol. That, or it wanted to attempt to BM. Does it even matter?

As I've said many times, SF does not care about finding better lethals. Lethal is lethal.
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GodGiven on 7/29/2016(UTC), BlackOak on 7/30/2016(UTC)
carins
#738 Posted : Friday, July 29, 2016 9:59:41 PM(UTC)

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http://pastebin.com/D2fkiRyt

It's not playing the Thunder Bluff Valiants, and then when it plays Al'Akir it suboptimized RBW and LB. Why is the bot using LB on a 0/1 taunt minion, RBW face after playing Al'Akir, when the opponent is at 20+ life? And when it has a perfect opportunity to drop out a Valiant? Is it playing around Gorehowl? Because two turns later the guy topdecked Variann and won
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sepefeets on 7/30/2016(UTC)
BlackOak
#739 Posted : Saturday, July 30, 2016 12:23:09 AM(UTC)
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carins;40043 wrote:
http://pastebin.com/D2fkiRyt

It's not playing the Thunder Bluff Valiants, and then when it plays Al'Akir it suboptimized RBW and LB. Why is the bot using LB on a 0/1 taunt minion, RBW face after playing Al'Akir, when the opponent is at 20+ life? And when it has a perfect opportunity to drop out a Valiant? Is it playing around Gorehowl? Because two turns later the guy topdecked Variann and won

To make sure that any mis-play is a real mis-play you must first change these two variables in settings.txt to false:

playarround = true;
useSecretsPlayArround = true;

If it does it again with these set to false, then it may then be a SF issue. I hope this helps :)

@sepefeets I can't seem to find a way to force Raven Idol (LOE_115) to select Discover Spell, any chance you can help?
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sepefeets on 7/30/2016(UTC)
sepefeets
#740 Posted : Saturday, July 30, 2016 10:31:11 PM(UTC)

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BlackOak;40044 wrote:
@sepefeets I can't seem to find a way to force Raven Idol (LOE_115) to select Discover Spell, any chance you can help?

A negative cardvalue on LOE_115b (choose spell) or positive cardvalue on LOE_115a (choose minion) should probably do it.
BlackOak
#741 Posted : Saturday, July 30, 2016 11:38:10 PM(UTC)
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sepefeets;40064 wrote:
A negative cardvalue on LOE_115b (choose spell) or positive cardvalue on LOE_115a (choose minion) should probably do it.

Hmm I was hoping you weren't going to say that, I have tried both, even to the extreme of 500. I'll double check everything again and get back to you :)
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sepefeets on 7/31/2016(UTC)
sadpwner
#742 Posted : Sunday, July 31, 2016 5:16:44 AM(UTC)

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http://pastebin.com/CgJAkj8H

Turn 2 should go face with the voidwalker because there's a juggler which could kill it next turn and it misses 1 damage on face

Turn 3, should have played the possessed villager to throw a knife b4 attacking.
_

For some reason, it doesn't use the creeper to kill 1/1s. It happen very often.

http://pastebin.com/AXD7Mgeq

Turn 4

__

http://pastebin.com/4mPNB0HZ

Turn 2, how to not play around a secret...

Can we just disable eye for an eye? No one plays it.
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sepefeets on 7/31/2016(UTC)
sepefeets
#743 Posted : Sunday, July 31, 2016 7:59:03 AM(UTC)

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sadpwner;40069 wrote:
http://pastebin.com/CgJAkj8H

Turn 2 should go face with the voidwalker because there's a juggler which could kill it next turn and it misses 1 damage on face

Turn 3, should have played the possessed villager to throw a knife b4 attacking.

Is it possible to disable play around aoe for when units survive so no calculations are made but have it play around aoe when units die ?

For some reason, it doesn't use the creeper to kill 1/1s. It happen very often.

http://pastebin.com/AXD7Mgeq

Turn 4

Both logs are the same and do not have any of the plays you mention. They all sound like they are leaning on the micro-optimization side that I warned you about though.
sadpwner
#744 Posted : Sunday, July 31, 2016 8:31:55 AM(UTC)

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sepefeets;40072 wrote:
Both logs are the same and do not have any of the plays you mention. They all sound like they are leaning on the micro-optimization side that I warned you about though.


Posted the same log 3 times for some reason -.-

For not killing the 1/1, I think it's the same problem with sledge belcher where it doesn't recognise units spawned due to data sync. I wouldn't have posted it if it was just a random 1/1 but it was a beast.

For the secret misplay, I found the log

http://pastebin.com/f4i9sSBG

This one is certainly not micro optimisation. It soulfires face just to check for an eye for an eye. If it played properly, the winrate would have went up by 50%.
Dre
#745 Posted : Monday, August 1, 2016 4:29:33 AM(UTC)

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@sepe (or anyone who knows)

Question for the new mulligan. could someone elaborate the differences between those 2:

hold;shaman;all;OG_024:1:CS2_106,0,0+CS2_222,0,2
\\hold 1 copy of OG_024 if you are shaman vs any class and have 1x CS2_106 and 2x CS2_222 but don't hold any CS2_106 or CS2_222 (other rules may hold them before/after this rule)

hold;shaman;all;OG_024:2:CS2_106,2,2+CS2_222
\\hold up to 2 copies of OG_024 if you are shaman vs any class and have 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222 and hold the 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222

Or other said:

Does the first rule means it discards any CS2_106 and CS2_222 even if it has OG_024?

Or other said:

Does the 2nd rule means it holds 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222 even if it has no OG_024?


Sorry for the noobisch way to ask this, I'am pretty sure i use it correctly but I dont fully understand the possibilites of these, and i want to know to improve the mulligans to the fullest.
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sepefeets on 8/1/2016(UTC)
sadpwner
#747 Posted : Monday, August 1, 2016 9:43:12 AM(UTC)

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Turn 6 didn't cast cloak field on the 3/2. This could imply that the bot doesn't know how to play with cloak field which is obviously a big issue seeing as that would make cloak field a completely dead card.

http://pastebin.com/E12v3fZF

Turn 4 doesn't cast unstable portal

http://pastebin.com/0kfqUXpF

A common misplay. It doesn't use its remaining mana to cast unstable portal when there are no other plays.
sepefeets
#746 Posted : Monday, August 1, 2016 2:46:14 PM(UTC)

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Dre;40079 wrote:
@sepe (or anyone who knows)

Question for the new mulligan. could someone elaborate the differences between those 2:

hold;shaman;all;OG_024:1:CS2_106,0,0+CS2_222,0,2
\\hold 1 copy of OG_024 if you are shaman vs any class and have 1x CS2_106 and 2x CS2_222 but don't hold any CS2_106 or CS2_222 (other rules may hold them before/after this rule)

hold;shaman;all;OG_024:2:CS2_106,2,2+CS2_222
\\hold up to 2 copies of OG_024 if you are shaman vs any class and have 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222 and hold the 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222

Or other said:

Does the first rule means it discards any CS2_106 and CS2_222 even if it has OG_024?

Or other said:

Does the 2nd rule means it holds 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222 even if it has no OG_024?


Sorry for the noobisch way to ask this, I'am pretty sure i use it correctly but I dont fully understand the possibilites of these, and i want to know to improve the mulligans to the fullest.

So first of all, holding/discarding is dynamic. By default everything is discarded if you have any custom rules, then the 1st rule is processed, then the 2nd, 3rd, etc. The 1st rule can say hold 2, then the 2nd rule can say hold 1 or hold 0, and 2 will still be held. However, if rule 3 says discard 2 then it will discard 2 even though the previous rules wanted to hold some. If the final decision is to hold 1 then it implies to discard the next if there are 2 copies and vice versa with discard 1 implying to hold the 2nd.

So with that said, the 1st rule quoted will discard CS2_106 and CS2_222 if no other rules have changed the default action for them. What "hold/discard 0" really means is "don't change whatever action was previously set."

For the 2nd quote rule, requirements are only processed if the main card exists in the mulligan so it is saying you must have 2x CS2_106 and 1x CS2_222 and OG_024 to hold them all.
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Dre on 8/2/2016(UTC)
sadpwner
#748 Posted : Thursday, August 4, 2016 1:17:59 AM(UTC)

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Turn 7 should tap loatheb to guarantee lethal next turn+ is already the strongest play.

http://pastebin.com/nbj5mdkg

Another example of horribly playing around secrets. Turn 4. Casts power overwhelming just to check for secrets.

http://pastebin.com/XftjtwB4
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